A Well Written Comment by A Bodybuilder Who Disagrees With Me

September 23, 2007

Just a quick background here, before the article. It appears that I have upset the members of a very large bodybuilding forum. My site is a bit anti-bodybuilding, so it comes as no surprise. What did surprise me was the hate-filled and homophobic and overtly obscene comments that were thrown my way.

Note: My blog is now setup to automatically delete any “hate filled” comments…that isn’t the tone I want this site to take.

One of the comments that was written to me, was actually extremely well-written. He doesn’t agree with me at all and slams my site a bit, but I’m cool with that. The Internet is suppose to be a place to exchange ideas, so I wanted to include his post in its entirety. I also want to thank him for taking the high road…

———-Start———-
From MAGNATE

Ok, you want a serious reply?

I’ll do my best to articulate why I label myself as a bodybuilder and feel this site is a joke. Hope this is okay with you, if not take it down again.

I go in the gym 4-5 days a week usually, I lift heavy some weeks, lighter other weeks (i cycle these phases to allow for CNS recuperation). I do this not to get a body that women find “attractive”, that is merely a side affect. My goal is to be a size that, I admit, most women probably will not find that pleasing, I don’t care. My motivation has never been getting checked out, although once again – it is a nice side affect. I do this for myself, not to please anyone else but myself. I started at 119lbs 5’8″ tall, skinny, barely eating, by all accounts a twig. I am now 183lbs 5’8.5″ tall (roughly), and still around 8% BF.

I feel better, I am stronger, I know I look better, I am happier and healthier for this. Your blog however, perpetuates an idea that all bodybuilders are “meatheads” to borrow your own term, in there to impress other people. We are not all there for that, but some undeniably are. Those people are not unique to bodybuilders however, you are indeed one of those people there to impress people (as evident by your many articles here), you just have a different idea of what is impressive. Please do not exempt yourself from this category of meatheads just in the gym to look better for the girls, you are clearly a part of that crowd, just smaller.

On to another point you like to repeat here. Girl’s find excess muscle to be a turnoff. I’ve yet to reach a size that makes this so, I have no doubt if I am walking around like Marcus Ruhl in contest shape, however that it will become true. You have many articles about how certain exercises build an ugly physique. Deadlifts help build a nice thick back, Bench press build strong shoulders and arms, squats nice legs and ass. Where is the ugly physique in there? If I was only doing those 3 exercises, than yes I would quickly become disproportionate, but why do you assume that is the case? The bench press overdevelops the lower chest? No, it hits the lower chest more than the upper of course, but the only way to cause an imbalance between the two is if I were to neglect incline chest work, which I don’t.

You seem to operate off the assumption that everyone here is ignorant and has no experience. Half your articles make outrageous claims with no substantiation behind them. On any site where people had real time under the bar, you’d be shouted down every time you wrote something like this article. Intensity breeds progress, and judging by your self proclaimed 19 years of training, you need more intensity.

I have passed your development in a mere 2 years? Why is that so? If you are happy with where you are, great. I certainly don’t expect everyone to share my goals, but I do expect you to keep your opinions regarding my goals to yourself unless I (or anyone else) asks you specifically about those goals. If I came on your site asking if I should still bulk at 190lbs, then comment away. As that is not the case, shut your mouth and keep your training dogma to yourself, it’s offensive to those of us that, heaven forbid, do grunt in sets sometimes. We don’t do it because we are trying to impress (to reiterate), or trying to get attention.

If I’m grunting in the gym, it is because there is a heavy object that needs moving, and yes, grunting can help. Get under a 400lb bar and try to do a full Squat without grunting. Pick up 500lbs off the floor without a grunt. I don’t purposely censor myself at risk of offending someone in the gym, if I am disturbing you with my grunts, approach me and tell me so, I will do my best to not disturb you anymore , but do not make any assumption as to why I am grunting.

Truth be told, when I am in the gym, I don’t want your attention, I don’t want you or anyone else’s eyes on me in the gym, except a spotter if need be. Your attention is meaningless to me, I don’t go around flexing to get people to stare, I know of nobody who takes up multiple machines unless they are running a superset, and maybe I like my damn 80s clothes (kidding, I lift in jeans and a t shirt usually).

Keep to yourself.
———-End———-

Magnate…It is good to see a bodybuilder’s point of view.

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{ 18 comments… read them below or add one }

C September 23, 2007 at 7:13 pm

Sounds pretty defensive to me. I think it’s a little hypocritical – if he doesn’t want to read about your personal theories, experiences, and advice about fitness, then he needn’t come here, OR leave such long-winded tirades.

Additionally, I’m personally offended to be referred to as a sheep, following your advice blindly. I read a wide array of fitness, training, and exercise blogs and I take all information with a grain of salt.

I happen to agree with a great deal of your advice and find most, if not all of it, extremely relevant and useful. Some of it I heartily disagree with. But it doesn’t invalidate everything else!

So certainly don’t keep to yourself, Rusty, because there’s a lot of us who enjoy your posts and use them to great benefit.

admin September 23, 2007 at 9:39 pm

C,

Thanks a bunch. I certainly don’t agree with any trainer 100%. I don’t expect people to follow every piece of advise I give…I really just want to get people thinking. If you read something here and it works for you, that is great…if not, then try a different approach. I certainly don’t see anyone here just blindly following my advice.

I actually like the people who “step out from the crowd” a bit. It isn’t always easy, because many people get really defensive if your opinion differs from theirs.

My mentors are people who challenge the status quo. I don’t agree with them 100% either, but I like people that aren’t afraid to have their own voice.

Pavel Tsatsouline
Ori Hofmekler
Lyle McDonald
Mike Mentzer
Craig Ballantyne
Phil Campbell
Tom Venuto

There are quite a few people I’m missing here, but the bottom line is that I want to provide unique approaches to reaching your fat burning goals.

I have extremely thick skin, so I’m not going to back down from posting my opinions on “my own blog”…LOL!

MAGNATE did seem a little PO’ed by a few of my posts, but I probably crossed the line a bit in a few of my posts. I’ve read a few of his other posts over on the forum he is a member of and generally he seems like a good guy.

Rusty

PS: Thanks for the support…it HAS been a tougher day than normal to say the least.

Tyler Durden September 24, 2007 at 7:14 am

hey Rusty,
I see suddenly you’ve become the number one public enemy among bodybuilders!:)) I guess you knew it was just a matter of time some furious bodybuilder puts the link of your site to bodybuilding forums…
You knew it was going to happen once but don’t give a damn, it’s your blog you can write whatever you want.
But you should expect another wave of furious “attackers” in the future that’s for sure!:)
Probably you crossed the line with that article on bodybuilders and there are a ot of normal good guys who build mass but they didn’t get the point you wanted to express.
Keep posting cuz there are plenty people who share your goals!

mido September 24, 2007 at 10:39 am

What C said.

It does sound a little defensive but to each their own. Personally I find guys wanting to get bigger and bigger ad infinitum the same as women wanting to get smaller and smaller – there’s usually and underlying issue that will end up needing to be addressed.

Honestly I wish there could be separate gyms for guys who like the prison yard chic, so they can grunt as much as they like far away from the rest of us.

Then they can feel happy with their ilk and the rest of us can feel happy not to be intimidated, annoyed, or just plain grossed out. It kind of goes both ways, and a musclebound guy in 80’s clothes, nay jeans is a bit hard to miss let alone ignore. And that’s before you add grunting.

I can understand you crossing perhaps a line with some of your posts because you’re talking about stuff that generally doesn’t get critiqued, and techniques and ideas that don’t usually get held up as wrong – it’s easy to slide a bit into ranting territory because it sometimes seems as if nobody else has a problem with it or is too intimidated to say anything.

Personally, like C, I don’t agree with everything you say (most of it, yes, but note everything) but I welcome new ideas to test out for myself. Most importantly I like an alternative to the currently reigning (and sometimes omnipresent) theories being presented.

So thank you Rusty, and do keep posting. It’s great to have an alternative out there.

john September 24, 2007 at 11:28 am

rusty,
just one question…I see a lot of stuff around by tom venuto…what does he say that breaks status quo?
all of the others you mentioned however, i think have great info though.
-john

Mark September 24, 2007 at 1:36 pm

Please don’t feel discouraged. As a frequent reader of bodybuilding sites, there’s always somebody who asks a question about how to get ‘hot’, for example how to get a brad pitt body and that person is shot down with lots of homophobic and or just plan bullying language. Maybe we should we bigger than to return the insults, but if reasonable people like this bodybuilding did a quick search on the sites he hangs out on for things like, get a brad pitt body, and saw what was posted, he’s be a understanding. The point we can all agree on is that people do have different goals, and if your goal is not to become huge then there are few resources for men out there. Even the pavel-MA sites, tho they’re against more muscle-obessesion, are still mostly performance based, not asthetics. thanks again….

admin September 24, 2007 at 1:40 pm

Tyler,

Yeah…I was expecting the attacks…not just all on the same day!

This blog is dedicated to helping people look thin or slim and toned. Bascially for guys and girls who want to look good in clothes and have a body closer to that of a hollywood sex symbol. I just don’t think there are many good sites like that for people who are shooting for this look.

Mido,

I’m all about testing new ideas and having a place where people try alternative approaches. I’ll keep writing about this despite the criticism. I don’t fall exactly in line with many of the popular theories out there, but if I did…what would be the point of visiting this blog? I’ll certainly continue to post as often as possible.

John,

I like Tom Venuto mainly because of his book Burn The Fat Feed The Muscle. It is pretty mainstream, but the ideas are presented extremely well. It is a massive book with tons of bonuses.

What is really great about his book…is that he doesn’t sugar coat the fact that getting in great shape takes a lot of work. He really helps people get in the right “mind set” to get in shape. I got a lot of value from the book. He actually has different goals than me, but I fully respect the guy for overdelivering on his products.

Jason September 24, 2007 at 5:02 pm

I would like to start out by apologizing for some of the comments on the other board of which I took part in. I, honestly, have nothing against anyone who wants to bring fitness/health/exercise to more people. I also don’t think that everyone who trains should have to train for the same goals that I have. I commend anyone that works toward their own goals…however, that is where I became perturbed by this site. Many of your posts seem to have no respect at all for the fact that some people work out for reasons other than your own. I don’t understand why you can be so disgusted by someone working very hard to meet their goal…how is this offensive to you or anyone else?

The things I do in the gym reflect nothing about me other than I am a very motivated person who is willing to work very hard toward my goals. I honestly have tried not to grunt, but it’s a natural response to pain, and believe it or not, I can actually move more weight when I give a good grunt. I do my sets of squats with over 600 pounds, and there is no way to not grunt when going through the set. If I drop the weights at the end of a set, it’s not because I want you to look at me and how much weight I was using. It’s because I just took that set past the point of absolute failure and I have absolutely no strength left with which to control the weight. If you see my cheating a set of barbell curls, it’s because I WANT to cheat. I am using techniques to take my set past the point of normal failure. I will begin using just enough of the rest of my body so that I can continue working my target muscle.

As for bodybuilders being intimidating…. maybe you just think that because of 1) our size or 2) an apparent stigma about bodybuilders. There are only 2 times in my life that I have attempted to intimidate someone with my size, and both of those situations occurred because my friends were about to get into fights and I thought it better that I just scare the other guy off, than let it come to that. In all honesty, I get approached by a LOT of guys who are new to working out (while in the gym) and I ave never refused to give them advice or treated them like they were stupid. I know they have come up to me because the assume I know what I’m doing (based on my build). But, I would never attempt to intimidate someone else in the gym…..

As for the 80’s clothes….. I must admit that that’s funny to me too 🙂 I wear athletic shorts and a t-shirt…. however, I will say that it’s not a fashion show in there. Aren’t you going there to accomplish something that is completely independent of the clothe you wear? I personally would rather be dressed silly than be dressed up in the gym. One time I was in the gym’s locker room and there was this guy who just got out of the shower that shaved, put gel in and styled his hair, brushed his teeth, and put on cologne. I assumed he had just finished working out, but to my surprise, He came out of the locker room and went straight to the elliptical machine! That is the sort of thing that annoys a bodybuilder…when you care more about what you look like in the gym than what you’re doing while you’re there.

You say that Magnate seemed defensive, but how would you feel if you learned that all of these people think you’re this absurdly annoying person who just tries to make everyone else’s gym experience as miserable as possible?

As for your goals… they coincide with the majority of society and I have nothing against you trying to accomplish them, however, I must put in my two cents about some of your theories…

As far as “muscle tone”, you can not train for muscle tone based on the way in which you lift weights. Muscle tone is a function of muscle size and body fat percentage. In reality, either the muscle grows or it does not. this is the only change that occurs. When muscle tissue is broken down, your body rebuilds it stronger as a mode of adaptation. So by lifting but not putting in a lot of effort, you are simply breaking the muscle down less, causing it to only have to grow a very small amount, either in density or volume. So you are in essence achieving exactly what a bodybuilder is, but at a slower rate. So here is my theory that I offer to this site which you can chose to take to heart or block out completely… wouldn’t it make more sense to train hard and for muscle size until each muscle is exactly the size that you want them to be, and then switch to maintenance only training? That way, you would reach your goals faster, but you could still stop when you reach your desired level of muscularity.

Oh… and one other side note. I always find it amusing when people say they want to be fit, but “not get too big”. Because, just so you know, it’s very very difficult to put on a lot of muscle mass. A lot of people train and eat right, but still can’t gain the mass they want. It kind of offends me that people think they could accomplish accidentally what it me years of ultra intense training and eating.

I am 5’10 and a fairly lean 270 pounds and I really don’t think I look all that disgusting. One person can’t day what’s attractive to everyone else. Every girl has her own personal tastes just like every guy has his. I know a lot of girls that do like the Abercrombie model look more than the bodybuilder look, however, my fiance’ obviously finds me attractive which is proof that everyone has their own preferences.

So… to each his own… let’s all just try to get along 🙂

admin September 24, 2007 at 6:39 pm

Jason,

Great comment…and I certainly don’t think it is easy by any means to have 270 pounds of muscle…especially at 5’10”.

There are certainly tons of women who are into all shapes and sizes of guys. The reason for my site is that there are a lot of women who like slim guys along the lines of Hollywood Actors and a lot of guys who like slim women without excessive muscle…I just didn’t see many sites dedicated to that.

As far as muscle tone goes…there is merit in strengthening a muscle without increasing the size of the muscle to increase tone. I know Pavel Tsatsouline along with a few other trainers who subscribe to this idea. It isn’t talked about much in bodybuilding circles, because it certainly isn’t a muscle gaining strategy. I know it isn’t a widely discussed mucle toning strategy, but that is why I brought attention to it. It certainly isn’t the only route to displaying tone, but it is viable nonetheless.

Rusty

PS: Those guys on the forums might be some of the best “roasters” I have ever seen…and I thought my friends were good at clowning on me! No problem if you joined in…it seems I had it coming.

Magnate September 25, 2007 at 8:13 pm

I was being very defensive when I wrote this, I didn’t think it sounded like I was trying to hide that. And I was more than happy to refer to people who sat there and agreed with the “Dear bodybuilding dork” article sheep because they are sitting there basing their opinion on a vast group of people based off of a few guys at their gym. Fine with me, I’ll do the same to you. Basing this purely off of a few people I’ve seen at the gym I will assume you all see very little progress, have poorly defined goals and do very little to reach them, and are too afraid to breach your comfort zone and try something new.

I know that is not the case (at least I hope it is not) for the majority of people on this site, just as the grunting bafoon is not the case for the majority of serious bodybuilders. Developing a plan (diet & workout) to reach that level of mass requires a lot of time learning (whether it be about nutrition, biochemistry, supplementation or different methods of exercise), a fact that seems to go overlooked.

By the way, Rusty you are much more developed than David Beckham (spelling?), give yourself some credit.

Andreas September 27, 2007 at 4:03 am

I pretty much started with this site and exercising. Then i read lots of other articles on the web (exercise.about.com, t-nation, …).

I respect bodybuilders now. Especially after reading the t-nation articles, i understand, how much discipline and scientific work is behind the grunting and sweating.

My personal goals are Hollywood, instead of Arnold, so i’m on Rustys side. This site is pretty unique as far as i know. Others are too strictly bulking or fitness. Fitness Blackbook hits a sweet spot in between for me. Cross-checking with other sources is nevertheless important.

admin September 27, 2007 at 2:44 pm

Andreas,

It is a great idea to go to other sites on the web…I do all the time. Actually a lot of those forums have great information…just don’t tell them you want to look like Brad Pitt in Fight Club! They will tear you apart.

That is exactly why I started this site 3 months ago. To share usefull information (much of it from the more harcore forums)…but towards the goal of looking “Hollywood” as you put it. I didn’t see a site like this either, so I had to create it!

Rusty

JohnnyG April 11, 2009 at 2:32 am

Your site should be allowed to express whatever you feel is important. Its great info that is acutally HARD to find on the net, where the bodybuilding sites are rampant and ill informed. Its clear to see that the guy has some major insecurities about what he does and who he is.

Denmark June 30, 2009 at 3:52 pm

I realiza this is an old post, but just feel the need to agree with JhonnyG when he says this info is hard to find online.
Really hard to find!

I used to go to the gym with a few frinds an they always stand around in the free weight section talking about who has bigger muscles…
I have always prefered the “fit look” and they never really seemed to understand this…

Everybody has their desiered look/goal and regardless what it is, it is going to take determanation and hard work!

bodybuilding July 14, 2009 at 7:53 am

What about female bodybuilding?

pitt November 29, 2010 at 5:33 pm

i hope i dont get flamed for commenting on a post from a while back, im not sure if an email pops up in people’s inbox when a new comment is added. If so sorry fellow fitnessblackbook readers and the bodybuilders as well…

Rusty
i haven’t commented in a while but i still read each and everyone of your post although it seems you haven’t been posting as frequently as you used to a few years ago….

with the sheer increase in comments for your posts recently i understand you may not have the time to reply to them all (after all you are doing this free of charge, much appreciated by the way), but as you mentioned somewhere you still read most if not all of them… i decided to comment anyway

i actually stumbled on this site by chance trying to get in shape a few years back searching for the tyler durden and cam gigandet workout… took quiet a few hours as well, but im glad i found it after countless of pages on fitness sites and blogs/forums reading the same comments over and over again, something along the line of “get an eating disorder and go to a tanning salon” to say the least… (although to be fair those sites are aimed at more mainstream bodybuilding and reading posts after posts asking about how to achieved the tyler durden look could turn out a bit annoying, similarly to people coming here and asking what to do to look like arnie) still no nead for all the foul rude language though, one could simply say this isn’t the place for that or atleast someone could really put something on the FAQs before posting…

what id like to say is that after introducing fitness black book to all my close friends, they all really enjoy and appreciate it, a few bought your visual impact course as well and seemed to work although they extended phase 2 a while longer as living in a tropical country you cant really afford to wear clothes that hide your physique without feeling like your in a sauna, and theyre not too keen on showing their flat looking guns lol… i have to say i was reluctant to share this site with my friends at first as we’re always competing in various ways but once my diet/routine started to differentiate a lot of questions arise with a hell of a lot skepticism and criticisms as well but as they say ‘share the wealth’, apart from my friends i do feel fairly offended when a personal trainer or another guy in the gym walk over or stare at a relatively small guy lifting really heavy weights then saying “whoah thats heavy”, ‘Im only doing 3 reps’ …. “why?!?” …’because i dont want to get big’ … then the whole lecture begins…

all i really wanted to say in this essay is THANK YOU!!! you have certainly helped out countless of people achieving their goals while still enjoying life and i will certainly continue to read all your posts, though it’d be great if you post a little more often, i came over this post by chance reading through all your post again (some more than a few times) to get make sure i dont miss any tips to help with the vacation blueprint as im hitting the beach for newyears…

regards pijj

ps. i think you may have also started a movement as recently (2010) there seems to be a lot more sites similar to fitness blackbook =]

oh and as for the leonardo’s the beach post, capepanwa is a very nice hotel, currently theres a newer one called sripanwa which from experience i prefer… being thai i hit different beaches almost all year round (depending on the monsoon seasons) and i noticed you havent one of thailands beach on one of your list!! but as you seem to appreciate the beach as well you should definitely hit thailand at some point if the chance ever arise and trade that corona for maybe a singha lite with lime for a more local taste…ive also noticed recently when dropping weight that its alot easier just having plain thai food and definitely a lot tastier than living on low cal home cooked meals, maybe a product of not being a great cook and that many western food are generally higher in calories… its also a lot cheaper!! so im kind of hoping for maybe a post on food and maybe substitutes for some readers in hotter countries… its like 2US$ for one strawbeery here…

anyway sorry for the essay and thank you again, best regards

Luca February 10, 2011 at 4:46 pm

rusty, this sounds very very desparate. even if its well written, he sure sounds like he wants to smash ur head when he sees u. anyways, he states he doesnt want anyone’s opinion. either way, hes doing it for other people. if he doesnt care, he pissess people off. if he does care, then he still pissess people off (because of his size/look?). i like this site because it gives advice on the casual look. the one that doesnt scare people away and doesnt say:gym. from my point of view, he does care. hes pissed off. why would he take his time to write this if he didnt care?

5freeebooks October 11, 2013 at 9:45 am

i like it 😉

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